Guest Wounded Soul 74 Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 I'm new here and I just wanted say it's about time there's a forum dedicated to people who've been hurt in therapy. Far too many people along with therapists want to blame clients for the harm they receive from these fraudsters that masquerade as professionals. My views might be a little extreme and I'm also speaking from a place of anger and hurt but as far as I'm concerned there's nothing about the MHS that is positive or good for individual people along with society as a whole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvester McMonkey McBean Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 welcome WS74 glad you found us and no need to worry about having extreme views about all things therapy. i, for one, welcome your contribution. i have found this site and the input from fellow members quite helpful as i had been working my way through my own messed up therapy journey for the past year. i literally, 10 days ago, just ended an almost 6 year therapy relationship and don't think i could have done it as gracefully as i did if it wasn't for this site and knowing that there were others who felt similar to me in regards to how harmful therapy can be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
here today Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 Welcome Wounded Soul, Hope you will feel comfortable here, as I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
here today Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 Also, although I may speak sometime from a somewhat more moderate position, I believe ALL critiques of the MHS need to be put out there and explored. Snuffing out the critiques without really looking at them is just really, really dumb. Too bad that's what the system does but I believe like you that a site where people who have been hurt in therapy can be heard is needed. And I'm thankful it is here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wounded Soul 74 Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 13 hours ago, Sylvester McMonkey McBean said: i literally, 10 days ago, just ended an almost 6 year therapy relationship and don't think i could have done it as gracefully as i did if it wasn't for this site and knowing that there were others who felt similar to me in regards to how harmful therapy can be. That must of been really hard after 6 years of therapy with this person. Therapy can be addictive even when you know something isn't right or it's even making your issues worse. 5 hours ago, here today said: Also, although I may speak sometime from a somewhat more moderate position, I believe ALL critiques of the MHS need to be put out there and explored. Snuffing out the critiques without really looking at them is just really, really dumb. Too bad that's what the system does but I believe like you that a site where people who have been hurt in therapy can be heard is needed. And I'm thankful it is here. It's my opinion that the whole mental health profession needs to be done away with. I don't think mental illness even exists at least not in the way the MHS claims, issues like emotional problems, relationship difficulties, shame and low self esteem, isn't a medical issue and can't be fixed through labels or strict boundaries constantly being thrown in your face. Unfortunately they don't see it that way or refuse to see the truth about their own profession. “It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
here today Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 How would you approach helping people with issues like the ones you mentioned -- emotional problems, relationship difficulties, shame and low self esteem. What about depression so deep someone tries to kill themselves, or anxiety so bad they can't leave the house, or seeing and hearing things that "aren't there", at least that other people in the same space can't see or hear? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve B Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 Hi, WoundedSoul74! I hope you'll find your soul feeling less wounded in our community. We're here to be supportive, but we also value honest perspectives regardless which way you want to lean. No worries! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoundedSoul74 Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 (edited) Quote How would you approach helping people with issues like the ones you mentioned -- emotional problems, relationship difficulties, shame and low self esteem. What about depression so deep someone tries to kill themselves, or anxiety so bad they can't leave the house, or seeing and hearing things that "aren't there", at least that other people in the same space can't see or hear? I don’t have all the answers, hell I don’t even have the answers to my own issues but the current MHS in my view is not the right approach. Maybe we need to change the language used to describe extreme mental and emotional suffering instead of calling these disorders or mental illness. I have terrible depression along with feeling suicidal, severe insomnia, and anxiety to the point of not wanting to leave the house but I hate thinking of these things as mental illness or that I’m disordered which just makes me feel worse and leads to feeling that I’m “other” or dehumanized and therapy magnified these feelings. What I believe about my own issues is a lot of it comes from an abusive family and past traumatic events. I can’t remember where I read it but there was study done about how mental illness is viewed from others and what leads to a lack of empathy and understanding, if people think mental illness is caused from biological or genetic causes the level of empathy for that person is lowered and leads to stigma and distance, on the other hand if we see their issues being caused by past traumatic events then there is more understanding and empathy. I believe most therapists see MH issues as biological or genetic in nature due to the training they receive and their belief in the DSM and of course they have to use the labels described in the DSM to make their treatments billable for insurance purposes. After my hurtful therapy I got a full copy of my file to find out what she was writing about me. In one session I was a really tired and she wrote that I had “blunted effect”, what this really means is just being tired or burned out but she couldn’t make any money that way so they have to use these pseudoscience labels. Edited April 16, 2017 by WoundedSoul74 Quoting here today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
here today Posted April 16, 2017 Report Share Posted April 16, 2017 (edited) I don't entirely agree, RC, as you probably know. My most critical "wound" was to my capacity to form my identity. I had a solid relationship with my late husband but he died. I had problems in my career because of issues, probably related to that of identify and how I fit into the larger whole. I couldn't re-form my identity after my late husband died. But certainly the way I identified myself primarily as a mental patient during the time I was needing and trying to find help didn't help. It kept me out of life, not in it. And since I felt ashamed, dysfunctional, etc., I kept myself out of other people's way as much as possible. I felt/knew that what I needed was something "social", but couldn't find anything like that except a support group called Emotions Anonymous, which reinforced the "broken" identity. Still, it was nice to feel I had some people who could accept me. Nevertheless the time came when I felt I needed to move beyond that, and I have, meeting people with similar interests on Meetup.com. The online forums have been a big help to me, too. But I agree with WS74 that the way people with "mental illness" are viewed by others, especially those who are paid to try to "help" us, can often create additional problems and exacerbate those related to how one sees oneself. Edited April 16, 2017 by here today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoundedSoul74 Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 16 hours ago, RealityCheque said: You can stop paying your therapist, but if you still have the mental structure of a therapy client, thinking in therapy language, defining yourself in therapy terms, labeling yourself as a wounded soul - you're going to have a really, really hard time ever improving, because being sick and broken has become your identity. I probably should have picked a different forum name but at this time this is how I'm feeling and therapy definitely increased the view of myself as being sick and broken. I'm trying to get over it and realizing that I wasn't the sick one in this, it wasn't unreasonable of me to expect trust and genuine caring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary S Posted April 17, 2017 Report Share Posted April 17, 2017 2 hours ago, WoundedSoul74 said: I probably should have picked a different forum name but at this time this is how I'm feeling and therapy definitely increased the view of myself as being sick and broken. I'm trying to get over it and realizing that I wasn't the sick one in this, it wasn't unreasonable of me to expect trust and genuine caring. I recall once reading (in a novel, I think) "wounds heal; scars don't hurt". That metaphor sounds like it is appropriate for your situation: right now you are wounded and hurting, but you can expect that the "wound" will heal with time. It might leave a "scar", but that's much easier to live with than the hurting of a still fresh wound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve B Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 Are clients really allowed to get their therapist's session notes if they request them? Reading their psychobabble could prove useful to the client, especially early on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoundedSoul74 Posted April 19, 2017 Report Share Posted April 19, 2017 2 hours ago, Eve B said: Are clients really allowed to get their therapist's session notes if they request them? Reading their psychobabble could prove useful to the client, especially early on. I don't know about private practice therapists but this was a community community mental health clinic and one of your rights as a client was being allowed access to your file although they will leave out some notes under certain circumstances, they don't exactly make it clear what those are. Eventually I'll post my full story (it's long) but after everything that happened I wanted to know what they were writing about me and their version. Most of it is actually quite boring but it's also a little funny to read. Here's one: "Mental Status ( Comment on current presentation) Client alert; movement within normal limits; hygiene and grooming within normal limits; engaged; eye contact within normal limits; clear speech; dressed appropriately for weather; organized thought patterns; positive affect, laughed when appropriate." Then she goes on about what I discussed in that session, that was one of the better ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvester McMonkey McBean Posted April 22, 2017 Report Share Posted April 22, 2017 On 4/19/2017 at 5:23 PM, Eve B said: Are clients really allowed to get their therapist's session notes if they request them? Reading their psychobabble could prove useful to the client, especially early on. i would love to know what my ex-T wrote about me and compare it to the records i kept in my journals. my gut tells me that he was way off more times than not... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamP Posted April 24, 2017 Report Share Posted April 24, 2017 (edited) On 4/16/2017 at 2:38 AM, RealityCheque said: You can choose to be broken, if you want. But there are other options. And the other options involve just getting on with life. The more you do it, the more you can do it. Agree, but some have impairments or demons that make this much harder than for others. So called mental disorders can be manifestations of real physical ailments that drive people into isolation. Some psychological wounds can produce debilitating physical symptoms. Things can get weird. My life is a disaster, partly due to this sort of confusing and debilitating can of worms. Agree that one's internal framing is critical, and therapy seems designed to intensify much of the bad stuff. Edited April 24, 2017 by AdamP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary S Posted April 30, 2017 Report Share Posted April 30, 2017 On 04/24/2017 at 4:55 PM, AdamP said: Agree, but some have impairments or demons that make this much harder than for others. So called mental disorders can be manifestations of real physical ailments that drive people into isolation. Some psychological wounds can produce debilitating physical symptoms. Things can get weird. My life is a disaster, partly due to this sort of confusing and debilitating can of worms. Agree that one's internal framing is critical, and therapy seems designed to intensify much of the bad stuff. Sadly, some therapists are so into "mind over matter" that they are not open to other possibilities -- and may even go so far as to carry out and publish research that is chock full of holes. A couple of examples that have been critiqued on the web: https://www.theguardian.com/science/sifting-the-evidence/2014/apr/02/has-cognitive-behavioural-therapy-for-psychosis-been-oversold (supposed treatments for psychosis/schizophrenia) https://www.statnews.com/2016/09/21/chronic-fatigue-syndrome-pace-trial/ (supposed treatment for chronic fatigue syndrome) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamP Posted April 30, 2017 Report Share Posted April 30, 2017 10 hours ago, Mary S said: Sadly, some therapists are so into "mind over matter" that they are not open to other possibilities -- and may even go so far as to carry out and publish research that is chock full of holes. A couple of examples that have been critiqued on the web: https://www.theguardian.com/science/sifting-the-evidence/2014/apr/02/has-cognitive-behavioural-therapy-for-psychosis-been-oversold (supposed treatments for psychosis/schizophrenia) https://www.statnews.com/2016/09/21/chronic-fatigue-syndrome-pace-trial/ (supposed treatment for chronic fatigue syndrome) Seems at this point most published research should be assumed fraudulent until proven otherwise. Therapists are given the power to diagnose, but most know nothing about human health. I have quite severe chronic fatigue. I don't even pay attention to mainstream discussion of this. If a therapist (or doctor) told me I needed to exercise more or some such simplistic advice, I would show them how ignorant they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoundedSoul74 Posted April 30, 2017 Report Share Posted April 30, 2017 On 4/24/2017 at 2:55 PM, AdamP said: So called mental disorders can be manifestations of real physical ailments that drive people into isolation. This is another thing that disproves the mental health field as a legitimate medical practice or science. When you see a mental health professional there's no medical testing whatsoever except for taking a generic test for symptoms of mental illness, usually a checklist that just about anybody could answer yes to. There's no testing for toxins, possible head injury, a bad reaction to medications, or a number of other things that can effect someones thinking or behavior. This might sound conspiratorial but is it possible fluoride in the water supply could be affecting a large percentage of people, GMOs, the huge amount of additives and preservatives in our food supply many of which are actually toxic, and daily exposure to environmental toxins but the MH system completely ignores all of this. Also the psychiatric medications can actually mimic symptoms of mental illness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdamP Posted May 1, 2017 Report Share Posted May 1, 2017 23 hours ago, WoundedSoul74 said: This is another thing that disproves the mental health field as a legitimate medical practice or science. When you see a mental health professional there's no medical testing whatsoever except for taking a generic test for symptoms of mental illness, usually a checklist that just about anybody could answer yes to. There's no testing for toxins, possible head injury, a bad reaction to medications, or a number of other things that can effect someones thinking or behavior. This might sound conspiratorial but is it possible fluoride in the water supply could be affecting a large percentage of people, GMOs, the huge amount of additives and preservatives in our food supply many of which are actually toxic, and daily exposure to environmental toxins but the MH system completely ignores all of this. Also the psychiatric medications can actually mimic symptoms of mental illness. Agree with what you said, across the board. Psychiatry and psychotherapy are almost entirely fraudulent and pseudoscientific practices. They are not legit forms of healthcare. Their only legitimacy is in crisis management, and even then the potential for harm is enormous and the purported benefits wildly overblown and distorted. And yet large numbers of people are totally invested in this system, as a way of life. Madness. Fluoride is a potent neurotoxin. Glyphosate (in the herbicide Roundup) is another poison that has infiltrated food and water supply. Most people have unsafe levels of mercury and other metals. Indiscriminate use of antibiotics has wrecked gut health which destroys overall health. Modern dentistry is one poison after another. The list goes on. Many of these things will cause psych disturbances. The MH system is not interested in any of this. And yea, their drugs create disease on all levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvester McMonkey McBean Posted May 2, 2017 Report Share Posted May 2, 2017 this conversation could not have come at a better time...just today i read an article about how therapy (especially couples therapy) can be helpful to reduce PMS symptoms: https://theconversation.com/men-can-help-women-deal-with-their-pms-76401 seriously?? maybe i am being a bit too cynical, but can't say i am going to pay a T $100 plus per hour to help with something that woman have had to deal with monthly for thousands and thousands of years due to hormonal changes. i can definilty think of better ways to spend that money to help alleviate any PMS symptoms i may be suffering from... just goes to show that perhaps Ts are getting quite desperate if they are willing to take on a client due to PMS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve B Posted May 3, 2017 Report Share Posted May 3, 2017 Psychiatrists are the only therapists who are also medical doctors, but they're mostly just pill prescribers who understand their drugs more than their patients. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PamB Posted July 19, 2017 Report Share Posted July 19, 2017 Hi Everyone. This is a new member intro post. I’ve found my way to this forum after several years of following the more than 1600 comments on disequilibrium’s bad therapy blog. I’ve spent decades trying to piece together what happened to me in a ten year commitment to Rational Emotive Therapy with a brilliant psychiatrist who ultimately showed himself to be a covert, seductive and destructive narcissist. Much of what I experienced in that work was liberating, but when I unfurled my wings to take flight as my own media work was going national, the full cycle of narcissistic devaluation and discard kicked in to punish me for wanting to leave dependency and him behind. At the tail end of the 1970’s nobody truly believed my story and the patronizing, infantilizing abuse in subsequent efforts to get help left me deep in C-PTSD dissociation. All of our stories are unique, but there are enough similarities in them to make a forum like this useful and I’m grateful to EveB for her work and to disequilibrium before her. Thank you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eve B Posted July 20, 2017 Report Share Posted July 20, 2017 Welcome and thanks for introducing yourself, Pam! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvester McMonkey McBean Posted July 20, 2017 Report Share Posted July 20, 2017 hi pam! welcome! glad you found us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mary S Posted July 20, 2017 Report Share Posted July 20, 2017 On 07/19/2017 at 2:44 PM, PamB said: On 07/19/2017 at 2:44 PM, PamB said: ... I’ve spent decades trying to piece together what happened to me in a ten year commitment to Rational Emotive Therapy with a brilliant psychiatrist who ultimately showed himself to be a covert, seductive and destructive narcissist. ... At the tail end of the 1970’s nobody truly believed my story ... Welcome Pam. I didn't even start therapy until 1986, but even then, it seemed that almost nobody would believe my experience was real. I've heard that RET practitioners can really be extreme. And it sure seems that the therapy profession as a whole has more than its fair share of narcissists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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